Popular in Anthropology

Anthropology

Watching Lacandon Maya Lives

Texas State University R Jon McGee

Anthropology

Muslims on the Margins

University of Wisconsin Madison Katrina Daly Thompson

Anthropology

We All We Got: Urban Black Ecologies of Care and Mutual Aid

DePaul University Symone A. Johnson

Anthropology

Much More than a Clinic: Chicago’s Free Health Centers 1968-1972

DePaul University

Towards a ‘low ambition equilibrium’

View more insights in Social Sciences - Sociology - Migration Studies

View more figures from University of Lausanne

View the page of Ihssane Otmani

Read the Study

No related posts found.

Ihssane Otmani explores the role of policy in influencing refugee educational and occupational aspirations and how this translates into promoting or hindering certain integration paths.

Image courtesy of interviewee. January 24, 2024

Log-in or Sign-up to Faculti
Currently viewing this subject insight as a guest. You have insight(s) remaining for this month. Login to view 8000+ figures on the platform.

Generating Workspace...

Export as PDF

This video video provides an overview of a dissertation focused on the educational and occupational aspirations of refugees, emphasizing the influence of integration policies on these aspirations. Initially, the study aimed to explore various theories related to refugees’ post-migration experiences but was narrowed down to specifically examine aspirations.

The researcher highlights a common oversight in existing literature, which predominantly addresses the aspirations of potential migrants rather than those who have already arrived in their host countries. They introduce the concept of a "policy dance environment," illustrating the complex interplay between refugees' aspirations and the policies they encounter in their new societies, particularly in Switzerland.

The researcher also differentiates between ambitious and realistic aspirations, incorporating a dynamic perspective that considers how aspirations evolve over different life phases. Furthermore, they discuss the concept of collective aspirations, where the goals of individuals are influenced not only by personal ambitions but also by community and state expectations.

The study is qualitative, involving interviews with 29 refugees in Switzerland, and aims to understand how various integration policies shape their aspirations. Three main policy themes emerged from the interviews, leading to the identification of a "low ambition equilibrium" where the combination of restrictive policies and the refugees' personal circumstances results in a focus on short-term, modest goals rather than more ambitious long-term aspirations.

The researcher critiques existing integration policies for prioritizing quick labor market entry over fostering the broader potential of refugees, and emphasizes the need for more inclusive, holistic policies that recognize the diverse backgrounds and experiences of refugee populations. The findings suggest that successful integration requires collaboration across various sectors and a more nuanced understanding of the aspirations and capabilities of refugees.

Language:

Export as PDF

X-TIMESTAMP-MAP:LOCAL=00:00:00.000,MPEGTS=900000

00:00.225 --> 00:03.525
The study is part of my dissertation entitled,

00:03.525 --> 00:06.405
educational and Occupational Aspirations of Refugees.

00:07.025 --> 00:11.565
Um, you know, at the beginning of this, of my work, we,

00:11.595 --> 00:13.485
with my supervisor, we had different ideas.

00:13.665 --> 00:16.245
We wanted to study, you know,

00:16.245 --> 00:20.285
this capital's theory in the context of, of refugees

00:20.285 --> 00:23.365
and post migration in conjunction with aspirations

00:23.505 --> 00:25.165
and how integration policies

00:25.185 --> 00:26.965
and different policies influence that.

00:27.225 --> 00:29.805
But, you know, it's too many things at the same time.

00:30.195 --> 00:32.085
Then we reflected even more about it.

00:32.085 --> 00:33.165
We did more readings,

00:33.305 --> 00:36.965
and at the end, we decided to narrow it down to aspirations.

00:37.665 --> 00:40.685
Um, so why aspirations

00:40.985 --> 00:42.885
and why in conjunction with policy?

00:43.105 --> 00:44.685
So, first, when we look at the kind

00:44.685 --> 00:47.365
of research we find on aspirations in the context

00:47.465 --> 00:51.605
of migration, a lot of it is focused on this, part

00:51.775 --> 00:56.245
where this study, the aspiration to migrate.

00:56.345 --> 00:59.365
But we were interested to study, okay, now people are here,

00:59.755 --> 01:02.045
they have, a permit, a legal status.

01:02.315 --> 01:03.845
What happens to the aspirations?

01:04.705 --> 01:07.885
And what was very interesting in the case of refugees is

01:07.885 --> 01:09.845
that I have this, this term,

01:10.025 --> 01:12.245
or that I use a lot in my, in, in this paper

01:12.245 --> 01:15.365
and also in my work, is the policy dance environment.

01:15.875 --> 01:18.725
What I mean by that is that refugees, you know, they go

01:18.725 --> 01:22.245
through very complicated situations in their life,

01:22.505 --> 01:24.325
in their home countries, for many

01:24.325 --> 01:25.725
of them transition country.

01:25.785 --> 01:28.485
And then they arrive to host society in the global north.

01:28.705 --> 01:30.885
And there are many policies they have to deal with.

01:31.265 --> 01:33.445
For example, they start to design policy.

01:33.475 --> 01:36.525
Then there is integration policy and education policy

01:36.545 --> 01:38.125
and other traditional policies.

01:38.425 --> 01:41.165
So I describe this as a policy dance environment.

01:41.625 --> 01:46.125
And we were also, interested to see how, people

01:46.225 --> 01:48.045
who come with, with aspirations,

01:48.105 --> 01:50.965
we become also even this idea of capital is not,

01:51.165 --> 01:53.725
I I don't really directly mention it in the papers,

01:53.865 --> 01:55.165
but we come with a background

01:55.505 --> 01:57.165
and then they find themselves in this

01:57.165 --> 01:58.445
policy dance environment.

01:58.705 --> 02:00.125
So we were interested to see

02:00.225 --> 02:02.925
how this shapes their aspirations

02:03.025 --> 02:07.125
and also how this translates into shaping their integration,

02:07.305 --> 02:10.125
trajectories or their experience of integration.

02:10.185 --> 02:13.965
But I focus on as aspirations is what people,

02:14.625 --> 02:17.245
are willing to invest, time, money,

02:17.385 --> 02:19.525
and resources in general to achieve.

02:19.865 --> 02:22.365
So, you know, in this discussion of the definition

02:22.365 --> 02:23.965
of aspiration, usually scholars,

02:23.965 --> 02:25.765
they talk about two types of aspirations.

02:26.105 --> 02:30.485
You have the, realistic ones and the idealistic one.

02:30.745 --> 02:34.205
So the one that I look into, are more the one

02:34.205 --> 02:37.685
where the person or the refugee tells me, I see

02:37.685 --> 02:41.125
that they are really willing to invest time and resources.

02:41.425 --> 02:44.085
And also I look at aspirations from a dynamic perspective

02:44.435 --> 02:46.005
because, as I said,

02:46.045 --> 02:50.005
I ask them questions about different phases in their lives.

02:50.505 --> 02:52.965
And for me, this is also important to see

02:52.965 --> 02:54.885
how these aspirations have evolved.

02:55.225 --> 02:58.205
And there's also, in the, in the definition of people,

02:58.205 --> 03:01.125
when they discuss the aspirations, the definition

03:01.125 --> 03:03.885
of aspiration, there is one scholar,

03:04.045 --> 03:06.605
I think her name is Hart, which she,

03:06.665 --> 03:08.685
she spoke about collective aspirations.

03:08.705 --> 03:11.365
So the aspirations, they're not just the representation

03:11.505 --> 03:13.885
of the individual, but also the representation,

03:14.025 --> 03:16.125
the representation of the collective.

03:16.185 --> 03:18.805
It can be the community, family, and the state.

03:18.865 --> 03:21.965
So also what the state aspires for you, like,

03:21.965 --> 03:24.325
if we look at these integration programs, programs,

03:24.505 --> 03:27.725
et cetera, also has an influence on, on these aspirations.

03:27.785 --> 03:29.765
And I take this into consideration as well,

03:30.305 --> 03:31.805
for this topic of aspiration.

03:31.985 --> 03:34.925
Uh, it, it, we were a little bit lost at the beginning, but

03:35.255 --> 03:37.925
after my interviews, it was clear

03:37.925 --> 03:39.765
that it's about aspiration formation,

03:39.765 --> 03:41.805
because there was not much research on that.

03:41.805 --> 03:43.925
Because when you look at the literature on refugee

03:43.995 --> 03:46.885
aspirations, many of it come to the conclusion

03:46.885 --> 03:49.165
that refugees have high aspirations,

03:49.635 --> 03:52.245
they have high aspirations to go to university, et cetera.

03:52.245 --> 03:55.365
So we wanted to question this conclusion

03:55.545 --> 03:56.845
and ask the question, okay,

03:56.865 --> 03:58.925
how these aspirations are formed.

03:59.265 --> 04:01.325
And for that, there is a literature on, on,

04:01.345 --> 04:03.765
on aspiration formation in general.

04:03.945 --> 04:07.605
And it's mostly a literature in the uk it did not study

04:07.765 --> 04:12.165
migrants, but it was more, it, it the are two main,

04:12.565 --> 04:15.325
I would say, strength of literature in this,

04:15.855 --> 04:17.045
aspiration formation.

04:17.045 --> 04:20.565
There is the status attainment theory, which basically says

04:20.635 --> 04:24.005
that, factors such as socioeconomic status

04:24.745 --> 04:27.965
and family, what they call them, significant others,

04:27.965 --> 04:32.325
such as family, teachers, peers, all influence,

04:32.545 --> 04:33.845
the formation of aspirations.

04:33.865 --> 04:35.845
But again, this theory studied mostly

04:36.245 --> 04:37.965
children and adolescent.

04:38.225 --> 04:40.605
And also there is another strand of literature, which,

04:40.655 --> 04:45.485
which is kind of, closer to, this study,

04:45.785 --> 04:50.245
it is called the blocked, opportunity, strand

04:50.305 --> 04:53.445
of literature, which basically studied, minorities.

04:53.555 --> 04:55.565
They were still Americans,

04:55.585 --> 04:58.845
but they were minority groups such as,

04:59.375 --> 05:02.605
black Americans or, Asian Americans.

05:02.825 --> 05:04.845
And then they found that people, in front

05:04.845 --> 05:08.485
of these block opportunities, they either, tried

05:08.645 --> 05:11.405
to aspire even more in order to compensate

05:11.425 --> 05:14.925
for these blocked opportunities or the give up.

05:15.685 --> 05:20.585
Uh, so these, I would say the main, guiding,

05:20.785 --> 05:22.225
strengths of literature for this paper.

05:22.365 --> 05:25.105
But, you know, in, in the paper also, I talk about,

05:25.545 --> 05:28.825
I mentioned the studies that studied, refugee,

05:29.085 --> 05:30.105
aspirations.

05:30.205 --> 05:33.865
And one, I would say, one of the points

05:33.865 --> 05:36.145
that made us even more, interested

05:36.165 --> 05:38.265
and motivated to study this is that most

05:38.265 --> 05:41.145
of these studies were conducted in the uk, Canada

05:41.285 --> 05:44.505
and Australia, with people who, arrived

05:44.535 --> 05:46.665
through resettlement, programs.

05:46.765 --> 05:49.465
And these people, they did not go through asylum procedure.

05:49.925 --> 05:52.665
So it was also interested to, expand the studies

05:52.805 --> 05:53.825
to continental Europe

05:54.045 --> 05:57.025
and to those refugees who had to go through, again,

05:57.395 --> 06:00.885
this very, very policy dance environment, which starts

06:00.885 --> 06:02.845
with asylum procedure, et cetera.

06:03.035 --> 06:04.245
It's a qualitative study.

06:04.825 --> 06:09.565
Um, I interviewed, 29 refugees,

06:09.565 --> 06:12.045
living in the country, Novo, in Switzerland,

06:12.205 --> 06:13.765
I have the title Switzerland,

06:13.865 --> 06:16.645
but again, in Switzerland, they are different provinces.

06:16.755 --> 06:17.965
They called cantons.

06:18.345 --> 06:20.125
And the, the, the,

06:20.305 --> 06:22.485
the policies in these cantons can be very different.

06:22.505 --> 06:26.205
So it's very hard to say I study, integration in,

06:26.205 --> 06:28.685
in Switzerland, you really have to be specific about

06:28.685 --> 06:29.765
where in Switzerland.

06:29.945 --> 06:33.685
So that was in the French speaking, Canton called vo.

06:34.425 --> 06:37.765
And, I tried to diversify,

06:39.025 --> 06:40.125
the gatekeepers.

06:40.425 --> 06:42.605
Um, so I approached different types

06:42.605 --> 06:46.245
of gate gatekeepers in order to get, different types of,

06:46.465 --> 06:47.645
refugees.

06:48.105 --> 06:49.205
Uh, so the gatekeepers,

06:49.205 --> 06:53.685
they were basically public organizations, who, are,

06:53.785 --> 06:56.365
responsible of implementing integration policy,

06:56.555 --> 06:58.845
responsible of accommodation, et cetera.

06:59.225 --> 07:03.645
And then they are, NGOs, who directly work

07:03.645 --> 07:06.845
with refugees or external, NGOs

07:06.845 --> 07:09.205
or organizations that are not state organizations,

07:09.305 --> 07:10.645
but are in charge of the

07:10.925 --> 07:12.365
implementation of integration policy.

07:12.785 --> 07:15.965
So I recruited refugees, and also snowballing.

07:16.125 --> 07:20.125
I used it also. Uh, so my criteria for,

07:20.425 --> 07:22.245
for recruiting the refugees, they had

07:22.245 --> 07:24.405
to be living in this country or VO

07:24.405 --> 07:26.445
or in Switzerland for at least three years.

07:27.075 --> 07:28.685
They need to have a permit.

07:28.905 --> 07:31.005
So, either the refugee status

07:31.385 --> 07:34.685
or the, another status that, that,

07:34.685 --> 07:37.765
that is expanded the paper called, Perme F.

07:38.345 --> 07:40.445
So I wanted them to be living in Switzerland

07:40.505 --> 07:42.205
for at least three years,

07:42.225 --> 07:45.285
and also to have a legal, like a permit that allows them

07:45.285 --> 07:47.165
to work and to study,

07:47.165 --> 07:50.125
because I wanted to see the impact of different,

07:50.425 --> 07:53.005
or how they experience different policies.

07:53.265 --> 07:55.085
So I did not want to interview people

07:55.185 --> 07:58.285
who are still in the process of asylum procedure,

07:58.545 --> 07:59.765
who may not have access

07:59.765 --> 08:02.085
to all the integration services offers, et cetera.

08:02.665 --> 08:06.485
Um, so, when it comes to interview process,

08:07.285 --> 08:08.765
I tried to,

08:08.915 --> 08:11.645
because, you know, interviews with refugees,

08:11.765 --> 08:13.085
I find them really tricky.

08:13.265 --> 08:16.725
And I think you, I, I need to be really as empathic

08:16.905 --> 08:20.565
and, you know, a a as I can,

08:20.565 --> 08:24.935
because putting them in a situation of an interview,

08:25.115 --> 08:26.295
can be very triggering.

08:26.295 --> 08:29.495
Because for people who have been through, these,

08:29.495 --> 08:32.735
asylum procedures, they have gone through many interviews

08:33.205 --> 08:37.135
that would decide, the outcome of,

08:37.155 --> 08:38.375
of many things in their lives.

08:38.515 --> 08:42.335
So in my interviews, I tried to, I always say I tried

08:42.335 --> 08:45.655
to give them, to give them the, the, the, the control

08:45.675 --> 08:48.415
of the interview in the sense that I told them,

08:48.555 --> 08:49.655
if you can leave

08:49.895 --> 08:52.815
whenever you want, you can decide not to answer questions.

08:52.875 --> 08:54.535
If any question, if you don't want to,

08:54.595 --> 08:57.205
we can stop the interview whenever you want to.

08:57.205 --> 08:58.885
So for me, this was very important.

08:59.185 --> 09:01.285
And I try, I try it as much as I can

09:01.345 --> 09:03.805
to share also about myself, my mi

09:03.805 --> 09:05.885
because I am a migrant myself

09:06.305 --> 09:08.125
to share about my migration background.

09:08.185 --> 09:12.165
So it doesn't feel as if, you know, I am this,

09:13.485 --> 09:15.925
I don't know, like superior person, whatever.

09:15.945 --> 09:19.285
But we also share this migration experience. It is true.

09:19.405 --> 09:21.765
I came here as a student, they came as a refugee,

09:21.905 --> 09:24.725
but we, at the end of the day, we all have,

09:25.195 --> 09:26.565
migration background.

09:26.585 --> 09:28.285
So this was very important for me to do.

09:28.505 --> 09:31.645
And because I, I speak Arabic, I, I conducted some

09:31.645 --> 09:32.885
of the interviews in Arabic.

09:33.825 --> 09:38.565
Um, and for the, for the analysis of the interview, I used,

09:38.705 --> 09:40.285
the software and vivo,

09:40.665 --> 09:42.965
and I used an inductive, approach.

09:43.985 --> 09:47.965
So, in, in the paper I do, in the results,

09:48.085 --> 09:49.885
I do speak about three main policies.

09:49.905 --> 09:52.285
And this policies, they came from the interview.

09:52.345 --> 09:54.685
So it, they were not decided beforehand.

09:55.225 --> 09:57.685
So once I read the interview data,

09:58.585 --> 10:00.725
so maybe I should mention what was in the interview.

10:01.185 --> 10:03.645
So it was, I asked them about

10:04.275 --> 10:08.445
aspirations in let's say three, four phases of their lives.

10:08.905 --> 10:12.365
So there was this, their aspirations in their home countries

10:12.465 --> 10:16.605
before they left, and their aspirations in a transition

10:16.605 --> 10:19.885
country, if they lived there for more than six months, if,

10:19.905 --> 10:20.965
and if that's the case,

10:20.965 --> 10:23.085
because there are some who did not live

10:23.085 --> 10:24.965
for more than six months in a transition country,

10:25.705 --> 10:28.645
the first year in Switzerland, now and the future.

10:28.825 --> 10:31.365
So I asked them about to talk about the aspirations,

10:31.705 --> 10:34.965
but also we spoke about other things such as their,

10:34.985 --> 10:37.165
social network, et cetera.

10:37.345 --> 10:39.885
The main result of this paper is this

10:40.265 --> 10:41.525
low ambition equilibrium.

10:41.865 --> 10:45.765
So if I need to summarize it, basically what it means is

10:45.765 --> 10:50.045
that on one hand we have all these policies, be it,

10:50.045 --> 10:51.925
integration policy design and policy

10:52.105 --> 10:56.565
and education policy, the promote the kind

10:56.565 --> 10:59.285
of aspirations that would lead to,

10:59.375 --> 11:02.285
quick labor market integration, basically, that would lead

11:02.465 --> 11:06.445
for to financial independence and for refugees to get a job

11:06.465 --> 11:08.485
and to get out of the social aid system.

11:08.585 --> 11:10.045
So this is the main motivation.

11:11.355 --> 11:14.855
Uh, so there is not much, I would say

11:15.575 --> 11:18.535
interest in promoting very ambitious aspirations

11:18.675 --> 11:21.775
or plans that would maybe be implemented,

11:22.045 --> 11:24.375
that would need more time to be implemented.

11:24.395 --> 11:27.215
But this is the main, the main motivation.

11:27.435 --> 11:29.815
That's one part of the low ambition equilibrium.

11:30.115 --> 11:32.015
Now, the second part is the refugees.

11:32.315 --> 11:35.455
Uh, so refugees for many reasons, because again,

11:35.605 --> 11:38.895
because of the influence of these policies, what they went

11:38.895 --> 11:42.455
through, during the, asylum procedure,

11:42.695 --> 11:44.855
I interviewed people who've been in this face

11:44.955 --> 11:47.615
of asylum procedure for three, four years.

11:48.195 --> 11:49.255
You know, it does a lot

11:49.255 --> 11:51.535
to you when you're in this limbo state for so long.

11:51.915 --> 11:53.725
And then you have the integration policies.

11:53.805 --> 11:56.005
I do present them a little bit for Switzerland.

11:56.005 --> 11:58.085
There is a high focus on vocational training

11:58.505 --> 12:01.605
and high focus on this quick label market, access.

12:02.145 --> 12:05.325
Uh, and also you have these, you have this system

12:05.375 --> 12:08.045
where if you wanna go to university, it's very complicated.

12:08.045 --> 12:10.885
There are many, hurdles, et cetera.

12:11.385 --> 12:14.205
So this is refugees. They have to face this.

12:14.345 --> 12:16.165
At the same time, they have

12:16.165 --> 12:18.405
to face their personal circumstances.

12:18.665 --> 12:21.645
For example, people who have their, their families in,

12:21.645 --> 12:22.645
in their home countries

12:22.705 --> 12:25.885
or the, in the countries of origin, you know,

12:25.885 --> 12:28.205
they've maybe struggling with many other things.

12:29.065 --> 12:31.525
So, and also many of them, they just tired

12:31.665 --> 12:35.885
of being constantly battling constantly in a, you know,

12:35.945 --> 12:37.285
in a confrontation state.

12:37.345 --> 12:38.605
So they're like, okay, you know what?

12:38.805 --> 12:41.525
I, I just want, a normal life.

12:41.645 --> 12:43.565
I want some sense of normalcy.

12:43.985 --> 12:46.725
And I, if you want me to get a job, I will also, you know,

12:47.085 --> 12:48.885
I, I will go in that direction as well.

12:49.305 --> 12:51.165
So here we see that the aspirations,

12:51.485 --> 12:54.405
regardless if they're very, ambitious,

12:54.405 --> 12:55.605
they're not really promoted,

12:55.665 --> 12:59.565
and the kind of many of them, they go alone.

12:59.705 --> 13:01.765
You know, they go in this direction.

13:01.825 --> 13:04.845
And the result of this combination on one side,

13:05.305 --> 13:09.925
all these policies and the expectations, et cetera.

13:10.025 --> 13:13.205
And then the refugees, both how they, the,

13:13.235 --> 13:14.765
they experience these policies,

13:14.765 --> 13:17.645
but also the personal, circumstances

13:18.605 --> 13:20.885
converge into creating what I call the law,

13:21.185 --> 13:22.525
ambition equilibrium.

13:23.105 --> 13:27.765
The policies, how they are designed today, they do not,

13:27.875 --> 13:29.325
promote,

13:29.765 --> 13:33.125
capitalizing on the potential of refugees.

13:33.455 --> 13:34.925
There is a big pressure.

13:35.145 --> 13:36.885
So what is considered

13:36.885 --> 13:39.525
to be a good integration is basically someone

13:39.625 --> 13:42.045
who is no more dependent on social aid,

13:42.395 --> 13:43.565
someone who has a job.

13:44.385 --> 13:47.685
And I think we need to kind of also,

13:48.045 --> 13:50.645
critically question this idea of, yeah,

13:51.515 --> 13:54.925
because many studies, they talk about refugees having,

13:55.105 --> 13:59.605
one of the lowest employment rate among the population or,

13:59.605 --> 14:00.925
or among migrants.

14:01.425 --> 14:05.525
So do we consider that it's a good thing that they,

14:05.525 --> 14:07.285
they have any, any type of job,

14:08.025 --> 14:11.485
or we should also question what kind of job they have.

14:11.955 --> 14:15.965
Does this job, fit into the potential of these people?

14:15.965 --> 14:19.205
Because yes, now in the short run, it's good.

14:19.345 --> 14:22.125
Now they have a job, their, their normal,

14:22.205 --> 14:23.565
no more dependent on social aid.

14:23.565 --> 14:27.125
But what are the long-term, implications of this policy?

14:27.295 --> 14:31.145
Would this just, foster

14:31.665 --> 14:32.905
inequalities in society?

14:33.325 --> 14:35.305
So that, this is a question I cannot answer

14:35.305 --> 14:38.825
because, you know, the, the people I interviewed for,

14:38.935 --> 14:41.665
most of them they lived in, in Switzerland

14:41.665 --> 14:42.665
for less than 10 years.

14:42.685 --> 14:44.985
And I think to answer this type of question, we really need

14:44.985 --> 14:47.545
to talk to people who have been here for, for a long time.

14:47.885 --> 14:50.265
And also, one of, I would say the implications is

14:50.265 --> 14:51.725
that we can see that

14:52.585 --> 14:55.845
we cannot really talk about integration policy

14:56.425 --> 15:00.685
and successful integration without,

15:01.755 --> 15:05.205
linking this to other policies such as migration policy,

15:05.355 --> 15:07.085
education policy, et cetera.

15:07.255 --> 15:09.005
Everything is intertwined.

15:09.825 --> 15:13.245
And, and we can also see that these policies, the, the,

15:13.385 --> 15:16.005
the kind of work against each others, you know,

15:16.545 --> 15:19.725
we have the discourse of integration policy, which yes,

15:19.905 --> 15:21.965
we need to be integrated, et cetera.

15:22.465 --> 15:25.605
Um, who put a lot of pressure on refugees themselves need

15:25.605 --> 15:26.925
to learn the language, et cetera.

15:26.945 --> 15:29.965
But what is, what kind of conditions are there?

15:30.625 --> 15:33.045
Uh, and then we have the migration policies,

15:33.045 --> 15:35.805
which becoming even more, restrictive.

15:35.825 --> 15:38.485
And at the same time, you expect people to integrate.

15:38.785 --> 15:41.645
And yes, people, they wanna go to university, get education,

15:41.645 --> 15:44.125
but then when they go to university, it's very complicated.

15:44.505 --> 15:45.885
So we see that this poli,

15:45.945 --> 15:49.125
you cannot really talk about integration without talking

15:49.195 --> 15:50.445
also about other policies

15:50.445 --> 15:52.285
and making sure that they work together

15:52.745 --> 15:54.325
and they don't work against each other.

15:55.065 --> 15:58.485
And also, I, I think one major implication of this study is

15:58.485 --> 16:02.685
that, I have in another, it's not published,

16:02.685 --> 16:04.805
but I just speak about, we need

16:04.805 --> 16:07.525
to have more inclusive integration policies.

16:07.525 --> 16:09.405
Because I mean, that's why sometimes people,

16:09.405 --> 16:11.045
they don't like talking about integration,

16:11.045 --> 16:12.645
but about inclusion in general.

16:12.915 --> 16:15.925
Because yes, you can have these policies that pretend

16:15.985 --> 16:17.685
to want to integrate people faster,

16:18.525 --> 16:21.005
whatever it's successfully, but then when you look at them,

16:21.005 --> 16:22.325
they're not really inclusive.

16:22.555 --> 16:26.525
They just, I think there is 1, 1 1 point

16:26.525 --> 16:27.525
that is very important.

16:27.715 --> 16:30.925
When we look at, I look at many integration policies.

16:31.345 --> 16:34.565
We see that we, they treat refugees as one hi

16:35.145 --> 16:36.525
one homogeneous group.

16:36.755 --> 16:38.925
It's like, okay, these are refugees. They're here.

16:39.425 --> 16:41.605
Uh, we want them to be integrated in the level

16:41.605 --> 16:42.645
market very fast.

16:42.715 --> 16:45.565
This is how you do it, vocational training,

16:45.585 --> 16:46.845
or you get a job directly.

16:46.865 --> 16:49.525
But these are people who have, they're not have one group.

16:49.875 --> 16:52.445
It's a heterogeneous group of people

16:52.475 --> 16:53.485
with different backgrounds.

16:53.485 --> 16:54.885
They come from different countries.

16:55.545 --> 16:57.005
Um, I think it's very important

16:57.005 --> 16:58.565
to take this into consideration.

16:58.625 --> 17:00.885
And instead of talking about integration,

17:00.965 --> 17:04.085
talking about inclusive policies can be inclusive migration

17:04.085 --> 17:05.485
policy, education policy,

17:05.905 --> 17:10.485
and where everyone in society should be, should feel,

17:11.225 --> 17:14.965
like concerned by, by this inclusion,

17:15.035 --> 17:17.885
it's not just the role of this organization in charge

17:17.885 --> 17:19.885
of implementing integration policy.

17:20.355 --> 17:22.725
It's the role of everyone, of the universities,

17:22.825 --> 17:25.005
of all the institute of employers

17:25.025 --> 17:26.325
who play an important role.

17:27.245 --> 17:29.485
Everyone in society is concerned.

17:29.485 --> 17:31.765
And without having everyone on, on board

17:32.105 --> 17:35.165
and making them understand that they are also in charge

17:35.265 --> 17:39.565
of implementing this inclusive policies, they,

17:39.565 --> 17:40.965
they will be, it'll be very hard

17:40.965 --> 17:43.805
to talk about successful inclusion or integration.

Refugee Aspirations and Policy Influences

00:00:00 - The study is part of my dissertation entitled, educational and Occupational Aspirations of Refugees. you know, at the beginning of this, of my work, we, with my supervisor, we had different ideas. We wanted to study, you know, this capital's theory in the context of, of refugees and post migration in conjunction with aspirations and how integration policies and different policies influence that. But, you know, it's too many things at the same time. Then we reflected even more about it.
00:00:33 - and at the end, we decided to narrow it down to aspirations. so why aspirations and why in conjunction with policy? So, first, when we look at the kind of research we find on aspirations in the context of migration, a lot of it is focused on this, part where this study, the aspiration to migrate. But we were interested to study, okay, now people are here, they have, a permit, a legal status.
00:01:04 - And what was very interesting in the case of refugees is that I have this, this term, or that I use a lot in my, in, in this paper and also in my work, is the policy dance environment. What I mean by that is that refugees, you know, they go through very complicated situations in their life, in their home countries, for many of them transition country. And then they arrive to host society in the global north. And there are many policies they have to deal with. For example, they start to design policy.
00:01:36 - and other traditional policies. So I describe this as a policy dance environment. And we were also, interested to see how, people who come with, with aspirations, we become also even this idea of capital is not, I I don't really directly mention it in the papers, but we come with a background and then they find themselves in this policy dance environment. So we were interested to see how this shapes their aspirations and also how this translates into shaping their integration,
00:02:10 - But I focus on as aspirations is what people, are willing to invest, time, money, and resources in general to achieve. So, you know, in this discussion of the definition of aspiration, usually scholars, they talk about two types of aspirations. You have the, realistic ones and the idealistic one. So the one that I look into, are more the one where the person or the refugee tells me, I see
00:02:41 - And also I look at aspirations from a dynamic perspective because, as I said, I ask them questions about different phases in their lives. And for me, this is also important to see how these aspirations have evolved. And there's also, in the, in the definition of people, when they discuss the aspirations, the definition of aspiration, there is one scholar, I think her name is Hart, which she, she spoke about collective aspirations.

Understanding Refugee Aspirations and Influences

00:03:11 - of the individual, but also the representation, the representation of the collective. It can be the community, family, and the state. So also what the state aspires for you, like, if we look at these integration programs, programs, et cetera, also has an influence on, on these aspirations. And I take this into consideration as well, for this topic of aspiration. it, it, we were a little bit lost at the beginning, but after my interviews, it was clear that it's about aspiration formation,
00:03:41 - Because when you look at the literature on refugee aspirations, many of it come to the conclusion that refugees have high aspirations, they have high aspirations to go to university, et cetera. So we wanted to question this conclusion and ask the question, okay, how these aspirations are formed. And for that, there is a literature on, on, on aspiration formation in general. And it's mostly a literature in the uk it did not study migrants, but it was more, it, it the are two main,
00:04:15 - aspiration formation. There is the status attainment theory, which basically says that, factors such as socioeconomic status and family, what they call them, significant others, such as family, teachers, peers, all influence, the formation of aspirations. But again, this theory studied mostly children and adolescent. And also there is another strand of literature, which, which is kind of, closer to, this study,
00:04:50 - of literature, which basically studied, minorities. They were still Americans, but they were minority groups such as, black Americans or, Asian Americans. And then they found that people, in front of these block opportunities, they either, tried to aspire even more in order to compensate for these blocked opportunities or the give up. so these, I would say the main, guiding,
00:05:22 - But, you know, in, in the paper also, I talk about, I mentioned the studies that studied, refugee, aspirations. And one, I would say, one of the points that made us even more, interested and motivated to study this is that most of these studies were conducted in the uk, Canada and Australia, with people who, arrived through resettlement, programs. And these people, they did not go through asylum procedure. So it was also interested to, expand the studies
00:05:54 - and to those refugees who had to go through, again, this very, very policy dance environment, which starts with asylum procedure, et cetera. It's a qualitative study. I interviewed, 29 refugees, living in the country, Novo, in Switzerland, I have the title Switzerland, but again, in Switzerland, they are different provinces. They called cantons. And the, the, the, the policies in these cantons can be very different. So it's very hard to say I study, integration in,

Researching Refugee Integration in Switzerland

00:06:28 - where in Switzerland. So that was in the French speaking, Canton called vo. And, I tried to diversify, the gatekeepers. so I approached different types of gate gatekeepers in order to get, different types of, refugees. so the gatekeepers, they were basically public organizations, who, are, responsible of implementing integration policy,
00:06:59 - And then they are, NGOs, who directly work with refugees or external, NGOs or organizations that are not state organizations, but are in charge of the implementation of integration policy. So I recruited refugees, and also snowballing. I used it also. so my criteria for, for recruiting the refugees, they had to be living in this country or VO or in Switzerland for at least three years.
00:07:28 - So, either the refugee status or the, another status that, that, that is expanded the paper called, Perme F. So I wanted them to be living in Switzerland for at least three years, and also to have a legal, like a permit that allows them to work and to study, because I wanted to see the impact of different, or how they experience different policies. So I did not want to interview people who are still in the process of asylum procedure,
00:07:59 - to all the integration services offers, et cetera. so, when it comes to interview process, I tried to, because, you know, interviews with refugees, I find them really tricky. And I think you, I, I need to be really as empathic and, you know, a a as I can, because putting them in a situation of an interview, can be very triggering. Because for people who have been through, these,
00:08:33 - that would decide, the outcome of, of many things in their lives. So in my interviews, I tried to, I always say I tried to give them, to give them the, the, the, the control of the interview in the sense that I told them, if you can leave whenever you want, you can decide not to answer questions. If any question, if you don't want to, we can stop the interview whenever you want to. So for me, this was very important. And I try, I try it as much as I can
00:09:03 - because I am a migrant myself to share about my migration background. So it doesn't feel as if, you know, I am this, I don't know, like superior person, whatever. But we also share this migration experience. It is true. I came here as a student, they came as a refugee, but we, at the end of the day, we all have, migration background. So this was very important for me to do. And because I, I speak Arabic, I, I conducted some

Exploring Policies Impacting Refugee Aspirations

00:09:33 - and for the, for the analysis of the interview, I used, the software and vivo, and I used an inductive, approach. So, in, in the paper I do, in the results, I do speak about three main policies. And this policies, they came from the interview. So it, they were not decided beforehand. So once I read the interview data, so maybe I should mention what was in the interview. So it was, I asked them about
00:10:08 - So there was this, their aspirations in their home countries before they left, and their aspirations in a transition country, if they lived there for more than six months, if, and if that's the case, because there are some who did not live for more than six months in a transition country, the first year in Switzerland, now and the future. So I asked them about to talk about the aspirations, but also we spoke about other things such as their,
00:10:37 - The main result of this paper is this low ambition equilibrium. So if I need to summarize it, basically what it means is that on one hand we have all these policies, be it, integration policy design and policy and education policy, the promote the kind of aspirations that would lead to, quick labor market integration, basically, that would lead for to financial independence and for refugees to get a job
00:11:08 - So this is the main motivation. so there is not much, I would say interest in promoting very ambitious aspirations or plans that would maybe be implemented, that would need more time to be implemented. But this is the main, the main motivation. That's one part of the low ambition equilibrium. Now, the second part is the refugees. so refugees for many reasons, because again, because of the influence of these policies, what they went
00:11:42 - I interviewed people who've been in this face of asylum procedure for three, four years. You know, it does a lot to you when you're in this limbo state for so long. And then you have the integration policies. I do present them a little bit for Switzerland. There is a high focus on vocational training and high focus on this quick label market, access. and also you have these, you have this system where if you wanna go to university, it's very complicated. There are many, hurdles, et cetera.
00:12:14 - At the same time, they have to face their personal circumstances. For example, people who have their, their families in, in their home countries or the, in the countries of origin, you know, they've maybe struggling with many other things. So, and also many of them, they just tired of being constantly battling constantly in a, you know, in a confrontation state. So they're like, okay, you know what? I, I just want, a normal life.

Refugee Aspirations and Policy Interactions

00:12:43 - And I, if you want me to get a job, I will also, you know, I, I will go in that direction as well. So here we see that the aspirations, regardless if they're very, ambitious, they're not really promoted, and the kind of many of them, they go alone. You know, they go in this direction. And the result of this combination on one side, all these policies and the expectations, et cetera. And then the refugees, both how they, the,
00:13:14 - but also the personal, circumstances converge into creating what I call the law, ambition equilibrium. The policies, how they are designed today, they do not, promote, capitalizing on the potential of refugees. There is a big pressure. So what is considered to be a good integration is basically someone who is no more dependent on social aid, someone who has a job.
00:13:48 - critically question this idea of, yeah, because many studies, they talk about refugees having, one of the lowest employment rate among the population or, or among migrants. So do we consider that it's a good thing that they, they have any, any type of job, or we should also question what kind of job they have. Does this job, fit into the potential of these people?
00:14:19 - Now they have a job, their, their normal, no more dependent on social aid. But what are the long-term, implications of this policy? Would this just, foster inequalities in society? So that, this is a question I cannot answer because, you know, the, the people I interviewed for, most of them they lived in, in Switzerland for less than 10 years. And I think to answer this type of question, we really need to talk to people who have been here for, for a long time.
00:14:50 - that we can see that we cannot really talk about integration policy and successful integration without, linking this to other policies such as migration policy, education policy, et cetera. Everything is intertwined. And, and we can also see that these policies, the, the, the kind of work against each others, you know, we have the discourse of integration policy, which yes,
00:15:22 - who put a lot of pressure on refugees themselves need to learn the language, et cetera. But what is, what kind of conditions are there? and then we have the migration policies, which becoming even more, restrictive. And at the same time, you expect people to integrate. And yes, people, they wanna go to university, get education, but then when they go to university, it's very complicated. So we see that this poli, you cannot really talk about integration without talking also about other policies

Towards Inclusive Integration Policies for Refugees

00:15:52 - and they don't work against each other. And also, I, I think one major implication of this study is that, I have in another, it's not published, but I just speak about, we need to have more inclusive integration policies. Because I mean, that's why sometimes people, they don't like talking about integration, but about inclusion in general. Because yes, you can have these policies that pretend to want to integrate people faster, whatever it's successfully, but then when you look at them,
00:16:22 - They just, I think there is 1, 1 1 point that is very important. When we look at, I look at many integration policies. We see that we, they treat refugees as one hi one homogeneous group. It's like, okay, these are refugees. They're here. we want them to be integrated in the level market very fast. This is how you do it, vocational training, or you get a job directly. But these are people who have, they're not have one group. It's a heterogeneous group of people
00:16:53 - They come from different countries. I think it's very important to take this into consideration. And instead of talking about integration, talking about inclusive policies can be inclusive migration policy, education policy, and where everyone in society should be, should feel, like concerned by, by this inclusion, it's not just the role of this organization in charge of implementing integration policy. It's the role of everyone, of the universities,
00:17:40 - who play an important role. Everyone in society is concerned. And without having everyone on, on board and making them understand that they are also in charge of implementing this inclusive policies, they, they will be, it'll be very hard to talk about successful inclusion or integration.

Faculti AI can make mistakes

Faculti

Popular in Anthropology

Watching Lacandon Maya Lives

Muslims on the Margins

We All We Got: Urban Black Ecologies of Care and Mutual Aid

Motherhood on Ice

Much More than a Clinic: Chicago’s Free Health Centers 1968-1972

Towards a ‘low ambition equilibrium’

Guide

Platform and Category Pages

Contact Us

FAQs

Guide

Interview Process

For in-depth insights:

For news and opinion commentaries:

Page Structure

Popular in Anthropology

Guide

Platform and Category Pages

Contact Us

FAQs

Guide

Interview Process

For in-depth insights:

For news and opinion commentaries:

Accessibility Options

Contrast Adjustment

Text Size Adjustment

Text Spacing Adjustment

Line Height Adjustment

Cursor Size Adjustment

Page Structure Options

Page Structure