Our Jackie

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Karen Dunak discusses the story of Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis through her evolving public persona, from campaign wife to First Lady to fallen idol to treasured national icon

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Institution: Muskingum University

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Karen Dunak discusses the story of Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis through her evolving public persona, from campaign wife to First Lady to fallen idol to treasured national icon

Image courtesy of interviewee. September 6, 2024

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The speaker expresses a long-standing interest in 20th-century U.S. history, particularly concerning women’s roles in politics, media, and celebrity. They reflect on Jacqueline Kennedy, whom they view as a pivotal figure, embodying a unique intersection of public and private life during her time as First Lady and beyond. The speaker notes that much of the existing scholarship overlooks her individual contributions, often reduced to her relationships with prominent men.

Through extensive research, including newspaper archives and the JFK Presidential Library, the speaker discovered a wealth of material about Kennedy, leading to insights into her role as a public woman and the expectations placed upon her. They argue that media and societal narratives frequently emphasize her affiliations rather than her autonomy, portraying women primarily as supporters of men rather than as independent individuals.

The speaker highlights Kennedy's savvy political awareness and desire to live life on her own terms, which they regard as radical. Despite her significant cultural and political presence, she has often been misrepresented as apolitical.

Ultimately, the speaker aims to convey Kennedy's multidimensionality and her impact as a political asset, drawing parallels to contemporary political dynamics. They emphasize the unpredictability of public reception to media and individual personalities, underscoring that genuine public interest does not always align with political predictions.

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Here are 5 key points from the video:

1. **Jacqueline Kennedy's Influence**: The speaker reflects on Jacqueline Kennedy as a significant figure in understanding women's roles in public life, particularly how she defied traditional expectations through her education, poise, and public presence, contrasting with the norms of her time.

2. **Lack of Scholarly Attention**: Despite her prominence, the video notes a surprising lack of academic research on Jacqueline Kennedy's individual contributions and legacy, which typically focus on her connections to the Kennedy and Onassis families rather than her own agency and identity.

3. **Media Representation**: The speaker discusses how media representation historically evaluates women in relation to the men they are connected to, often overshadowing their individual accomplishments and personal narratives. This trend persisted even as societal norms evolved.

4. **Jacqueline Kennedy's Life Post-Presidency**: The video highlights that Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis continued to have a vibrant life beyond her time as First Lady, indicating her capacity for independence and personal fulfillment that went largely unacknowledged by the media.

5. **Fascination and Complexity**: The author emphasizes the public's ongoing fascination with Jacqueline Kennedy, suggesting that her life was multifaceted and politically engaged, challenging the stereotype of her as apolitical and emphasizing her ability to live authentically on her own terms without needing to justify her choices to society.

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Here are some of the key quotes from the video:

1. **Interest in Intersection of Politics and Entertainment:**
- "I became increasingly interested in the ways that politics and entertainment and media were intersecting."

2. **Influence of Jacqueline Kennedy:**
- "Jacqueline Kennedy to her was a one woman revolution... she was educated and unafraid of showing that she was educated."

3. **Lack of Scholarly Attention:**
- "It was very surprising to me that people who do US women's history... had really not done much with her."

4. **Media Representation of Women:**
- "There is this sense of like a woman's primary objective should be to serve others... the idea that a woman would operate based on her own desires or her own interests just seems a very difficult concept for those orchestrating American media to comprehend."

5. **Jacqueline Kennedy’s identity:**
- "She is often evaluated based on the man to whom she is wed... Jacqueline Kennedy slash Onassis in her own right is often overlooked."

6. **Perception of First Ladies:**
- "Even when right in front of you there is an obvious... a life beyond the domestic."

7. **Jacqueline Kennedy's Radical Independence:**
- "I did what I wanted to because I wanted to, and you know, take it or leave it."

8. **Political Savvy:**
- "She is incredibly savvy and incredibly interested in the world."

9. **Impact of Media on Public Perception:**
- "The public was wild for her... the organic attraction to her is really fascinating."

10. **Reflection on historical narratives:**
- "The media became the CoStar... even with all these changes to understand the consequence of those changes and challenges."

These quotes encapsulate the author's exploration of Jacqueline Kennedy's role and representation in American history, media, and feminism, highlighting the ongoing challenges women face regarding public perception and identity.

X-TIMESTAMP-MAP:LOCAL=00:00:00.000,MPEGTS=900000

00:00.285 --> 00:04.605
I have long been interested in 20th century US history

00:04.905 --> 00:06.845
and issues related to women

00:07.905 --> 00:10.045
and celebrity and media.

00:10.625 --> 00:12.765
And I became increasingly interested in the ways

00:12.765 --> 00:15.605
that politics and entertainment

00:16.985 --> 00:18.605
and media were intersecting.

00:19.185 --> 00:21.165
And as I was thinking about a book project,

00:21.365 --> 00:23.645
I remembered a book I had read when I was a graduate student

00:23.825 --> 00:26.325
called, where the Girls Are by Stu Susan Douglas.

00:27.265 --> 00:30.125
And she writes about growing up as a baby boomer

00:30.465 --> 00:32.525
and what she read and what she listened to

00:32.525 --> 00:35.325
and what she watched and what that communicated her

00:35.465 --> 00:37.205
to her about what it meant to be a woman.

00:38.305 --> 00:41.405
And she referenced the 1960 campaign

00:41.505 --> 00:44.525
and how Jacqueline Kennedy to her was a one woman revolution

00:45.385 --> 00:48.525
and just that she was unlike anything else she had seen,

00:48.755 --> 00:49.885
that she was educated

00:49.985 --> 00:53.045
and unafraid of showing that she was educated,

00:53.555 --> 00:55.725
that she was not in the background to her husband,

00:55.755 --> 00:59.605
that she often out shown this wildly charismatic man.

01:00.665 --> 01:02.765
And I went looking to see

01:02.765 --> 01:05.325
what other scholars had written about Joly Kennedy.

01:06.225 --> 01:09.685
And it was very surprising to me that people

01:09.785 --> 01:13.005
who do us women's history from an academic

01:13.065 --> 01:16.245
or scholarly perspective had really not done much with her.

01:16.875 --> 01:19.165
That she's very much in like the Kennedy cannon

01:19.425 --> 01:23.165
and these sort of like tell all, biographies

01:23.165 --> 01:26.965
of the family that I think are speculative or gossipy

01:27.025 --> 01:29.165
or like are either love letters

01:29.865 --> 01:31.645
or diatribes against the Kennedys.

01:32.545 --> 01:34.805
But in the world of evaluating her in her own

01:34.805 --> 01:36.485
right, there was very little.

01:37.065 --> 01:40.085
Um, and to me, I was very interested in her

01:40.185 --> 01:42.845
and what had happened in the aftermath of her time

01:42.845 --> 01:45.765
as First Lady and that she had had this whole life.

01:46.985 --> 01:48.565
And in the 1960s and 1970s,

01:48.565 --> 01:50.085
she was the most famous woman in the world.

01:50.865 --> 01:55.135
So I knew there would be like an embarrassment

01:55.135 --> 01:56.335
of riches when it came to sources.

01:57.355 --> 02:00.615
And I thought, what a way to talk about expectations

02:00.635 --> 02:02.495
of public womanhood in the United States,

02:03.655 --> 02:05.345
then Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis.

02:05.805 --> 02:07.705
So it just seemed like my interest,

02:07.825 --> 02:09.705
I suspected other people would be interested in this.

02:10.485 --> 02:13.105
And also the availability of the sources

02:13.695 --> 02:16.145
made me think this would be a good project for me.

02:16.465 --> 02:17.665
I started out, and I,

02:17.785 --> 02:20.945
I should say I don't work at a research one institution.

02:21.525 --> 02:24.185
Um, I'm at a small college in Appalachian, Ohio.

02:24.825 --> 02:28.585
I teach four four, so I don't have the luxury of a lot of

02:29.345 --> 02:32.425
resources or money or a big library or lots of time off.

02:33.245 --> 02:34.705
Um, so I was really thinking about

02:34.705 --> 02:36.505
what sources I could get here.

02:37.165 --> 02:39.705
Um, so I was spending time on newspaper archive.

02:40.345 --> 02:43.145
I was spending time on the New York Times archive,

02:43.255 --> 02:44.625
when I could go places.

02:44.905 --> 02:46.865
I went to the John F. Kennedy public

02:46.885 --> 02:48.025
or presidential library.

02:48.725 --> 02:50.865
And then it was wonderful as I did this project,

02:50.895 --> 02:53.785
they digitized a lot of things, so that was very useful.

02:54.485 --> 02:57.105
Um, then I just was sort of looking at

02:57.215 --> 02:59.025
what was out there very broadly

02:59.825 --> 03:03.565
and a lot of interlibrary loan about biographies

03:03.785 --> 03:07.365
or tell alls whatever I could get I got

03:07.465 --> 03:09.165
and I just dove in.

03:09.545 --> 03:11.005
And it definitely was a project where

03:11.725 --> 03:12.885
I did start at the beginning

03:13.315 --> 03:15.645
that I went chronologically over time

03:16.665 --> 03:19.485
and just sort, sort of started mapping

03:20.765 --> 03:24.855
what newspapers, what television, what the campaign

03:25.755 --> 03:27.415
had to say about Jacqueline Kennedy

03:28.665 --> 03:30.765
and started connecting the dots

03:31.145 --> 03:32.245
for what those things would be.

03:32.485 --> 03:35.605
I would say a representation of her in her role as wife

03:35.845 --> 03:38.985
and mother was really at the heart

03:39.085 --> 03:41.425
of the early representations.

03:42.205 --> 03:45.025
And I think over the course of her life,

03:45.125 --> 03:49.425
she is often evaluated based on the man to whom she is wed,

03:49.935 --> 03:53.385
that she is Kennedy, or she is Onassis,

03:54.085 --> 03:59.075
and that Jacqueline Kennedy slash Onassis

03:59.215 --> 04:02.495
in her own right is often overlooked

04:02.715 --> 04:05.815
or is not really considered an individual capacity.

04:05.885 --> 04:09.415
It's very much in her role as allied with these two men.

04:09.995 --> 04:14.465
Um, yeah, and I think that's true even

04:14.465 --> 04:16.345
after John Kennedy is assassinated,

04:16.645 --> 04:18.905
she is very much of the Kennedy.

04:20.045 --> 04:22.785
She is not granted any sort

04:22.785 --> 04:25.505
of autonomy really of her own.

04:25.725 --> 04:28.625
And then with Onassis, she's associated with his wealth

04:28.645 --> 04:31.785
and his excess and like in ways that he is unscrupulous.

04:32.485 --> 04:34.825
Um, that I think that when she really,

04:35.605 --> 04:39.955
and even when John Kennedy is assassinated, Aristotle,

04:39.955 --> 04:43.275
an essis has died, there is still this propensity

04:43.655 --> 04:46.755
to connect her to either one of these two men,

04:47.265 --> 04:48.515
even though she's living a life

04:48.515 --> 04:53.425
of her own design based on her own interests must,

04:53.425 --> 04:55.465
there's a reluctance to grant her that personhood.

04:55.505 --> 04:57.705
I, I think it is to the heart of the book

04:57.705 --> 04:59.465
that there is this sense of like

05:00.225 --> 05:04.065
a woman's primary objective should be to serve others,

05:04.935 --> 05:07.145
that it should be the husband or the family

05:07.165 --> 05:08.665
or the children or the nation.

05:09.445 --> 05:11.505
And the idea that a woman

05:12.275 --> 05:14.385
would operate based on her own desires

05:14.765 --> 05:19.705
or her own interests just seems a very difficult concept

05:20.645 --> 05:25.185
for those orchestrating American media to comprehend.

05:25.385 --> 05:28.865
I think the frame of women just as always, to tie them

05:28.865 --> 05:31.785
to someone else that they should be doing for others.

05:32.885 --> 05:36.065
And I think in that capacity, it over the media,

05:36.365 --> 05:38.265
and I would say this about the New York Times,

05:38.585 --> 05:40.625
I would say this about tv, radio mirror,

05:41.305 --> 05:43.945
I would say this about the range of media that exists.

05:44.015 --> 05:45.345
It's very challenging.

05:46.045 --> 05:48.865
Um, and I mean sometimes seemingly impossible

05:49.725 --> 05:52.785
for these sources to evaluate her on her own

05:52.965 --> 05:56.465
as we're going from the 1950s into the book goes into the

05:56.625 --> 05:59.005
1990s, even

05:59.305 --> 06:01.925
as there is this changing landscape for women.

06:02.025 --> 06:03.965
And you know, when I first wrote the book, I was like,

06:03.985 --> 06:06.925
the, the CoStar is going to be Women's liberation,

06:07.215 --> 06:08.685
Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis

06:08.685 --> 06:10.325
and Women's Liberation and how they intersect.

06:10.425 --> 06:12.325
And that ended up like being

06:12.345 --> 06:14.405
around pegan a square hole that didn't work together.

06:14.505 --> 06:16.325
The media became the CoStar.

06:17.025 --> 06:19.365
And I think even with these dramatic changes

06:19.625 --> 06:22.365
and social movements and political advances

06:22.365 --> 06:26.895
and changes in the culture, the ongoing expectation is

06:26.895 --> 06:30.535
that there is this domestic role that women serve.

06:30.725 --> 06:35.175
Even, even when right in front of you there is an obvious,

06:36.275 --> 06:40.025
a life beyond the domestic,

06:40.325 --> 06:44.745
but the, I think that there just is a real difficulty even

06:44.745 --> 06:48.145
with all these changes to understand the consequence

06:48.145 --> 06:49.345
of those changes and challenges.

06:49.665 --> 06:53.585
I really think, you know, people I think are fascinated

06:53.645 --> 06:55.105
by Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis.

06:55.105 --> 06:56.425
Like when I, when I am out

06:56.425 --> 06:57.785
and about, people are like,

06:57.785 --> 06:59.105
what a fascinating life she led.

06:59.445 --> 07:01.505
Can you imagine being there for the assassination?

07:01.605 --> 07:03.065
Do you think she loves John Kennedy?

07:03.245 --> 07:05.985
Do you think she like that there is just this interest in

07:05.985 --> 07:09.265
her and I, I hope the book communicates like

07:09.265 --> 07:12.865
what a multidimensional figure she was in her own right.

07:13.645 --> 07:16.305
Um, and I think, you know, there is this propensity

07:16.525 --> 07:18.545
to talk about her as an apolitical person,

07:19.165 --> 07:22.945
and that is wildly untrue, that she is incredibly savvy

07:23.485 --> 07:25.265
and incredibly interested in the world.

07:26.455 --> 07:29.675
And I think also the fact that she lives a life

07:31.335 --> 07:32.595
and does what she wants

07:33.415 --> 07:37.445
and never feels compelled to explain

07:38.265 --> 07:42.565
or to justify, I think is wildly radical that she's like,

07:42.605 --> 07:45.285
I did what I wanted to because I wanted to,

07:45.825 --> 07:48.085
and you know, take it or leave it.

07:48.545 --> 07:50.925
And just, I think that capacity,

07:53.495 --> 07:56.135
I try not to be like a biographer who loves too much,

07:56.475 --> 07:58.815
but I'm so impressed with that component of her.

07:59.255 --> 08:04.135
I think it is the capacity in which a political spouse

08:04.795 --> 08:08.255
or a political first lady can really be an asset

08:08.255 --> 08:10.375
to a campaign and to an administration.

08:12.035 --> 08:16.725
I think if we're, if I'm going back

08:16.725 --> 08:18.045
to the 1960 campaign,

08:18.945 --> 08:23.205
and I'm also thinking about 2024, the idea

08:23.205 --> 08:24.285
that people were like, God,

08:24.425 --> 08:26.445
the public is not gonna like Jackie Kennedy,

08:26.865 --> 08:28.245
how maybe we should hide her.

08:28.265 --> 08:30.325
And then the public was wild for her.

08:30.865 --> 08:33.805
So I think the idea that like pollsters know

08:34.145 --> 08:37.355
or like, I don't know, the political leaders are like,

08:37.355 --> 08:38.395
we know what the people want.

08:39.135 --> 08:43.325
Maybe not that, that it feels, even

08:43.325 --> 08:45.605
with the Kennedy's team's attention to media,

08:45.795 --> 08:49.045
like the organic attraction to her is

08:49.615 --> 08:51.115
really fascinating.

08:51.415 --> 08:53.635
And I think there is this capacity in which

08:54.215 --> 08:58.035
you never know when the tide is gonna turn and this new

08:58.135 --> 09:00.795
and untested image or brand

09:00.855 --> 09:02.155
or personality that you have,

09:02.575 --> 09:03.835
who knows what's gonna stick when.

"Unveiling Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis: A Study of Women, Media, and Public Identity in 20th Century America"

00:00:00 - I have long been interested in 20th century US history and issues related to women and celebrity and media. And I became increasingly interested in the ways that politics and entertainment and media were intersecting. And as I was thinking about a book project, I remembered a book I had read when I was a graduate student called, where the Girls Are by Stu Susan Douglas. And she writes about growing up as a baby boomer and what she read and what she listened to and what she watched and what that communicated her to her about what it meant to be a woman. And she referenced the 1960 campaign
00:00:45 - and just that she was unlike anything else she had seen, that she was educated and unafraid of showing that she was educated, that she was not in the background to her husband, that she often out shown this wildly charismatic man. And I went looking to see what other scholars had written about Joly Kennedy. And it was very surprising to me that people who do us women's history from an academic or scholarly perspective had really not done much with her. That she's very much in like the Kennedy cannon and these sort of like tell all, biographies
00:01:27 - or like are either love letters or diatribes against the Kennedys. But in the world of evaluating her in her own right, there was very little. and to me, I was very interested in her and what had happened in the aftermath of her time as First Lady and that she had had this whole life. And in the 1960s and 1970s, she was the most famous woman in the world. So I knew there would be like an embarrassment of riches when it came to sources. And I thought, what a way to talk about expectations of public womanhood in the United States,
00:02:05 - So it just seemed like my interest, I suspected other people would be interested in this. And also the availability of the sources made me think this would be a good project for me. I started out, and I, I should say I don't work at a research one institution. I'm at a small college in Appalachian, Ohio. I teach four four, so I don't have the luxury of a lot of resources or money or a big library or lots of time off. so I was really thinking about what sources I could get here. so I was spending time on newspaper archive. I was spending time on the New York Times archive, when I could go places.
00:02:46 - or presidential library. And then it was wonderful as I did this project, they digitized a lot of things, so that was very useful. then I just was sort of looking at what was out there very broadly and a lot of interlibrary loan about biographies or tell alls whatever I could get I got and I just dove in. And it definitely was a project where I did start at the beginning that I went chronologically over time and just sort, sort of started mapping what newspapers, what television, what the campaign
00:03:28 - and started connecting the dots for what those things would be. I would say a representation of her in her role as wife and mother was really at the heart of the early representations. And I think over the course of her life, she is often evaluated based on the man to whom she is wed, that she is Kennedy, or she is Onassis, and that Jacqueline Kennedy slash Onassis in her own right is often overlooked or is not really considered an individual capacity.

"Redefining Womanhood: The Overlooked Legacy of Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis"

00:04:09 - yeah, and I think that's true even after John Kennedy is assassinated, she is very much of the Kennedy. She is not granted any sort of autonomy really of her own. And then with Onassis, she's associated with his wealth and his excess and like in ways that he is unscrupulous. that I think that when she really, and even when John Kennedy is assassinated, Aristotle, an essis has died, there is still this propensity to connect her to either one of these two men,
00:04:48 - of her own design based on her own interests must, there's a reluctance to grant her that personhood. I, I think it is to the heart of the book that there is this sense of like a woman's primary objective should be to serve others, that it should be the husband or the family or the children or the nation. And the idea that a woman would operate based on her own desires or her own interests just seems a very difficult concept for those orchestrating American media to comprehend. I think the frame of women just as always, to tie them
00:05:32 - And I think in that capacity, it over the media, and I would say this about the New York Times, I would say this about tv, radio mirror, I would say this about the range of media that exists. It's very challenging. and I mean sometimes seemingly impossible for these sources to evaluate her on her own as we're going from the 1950s into the book goes into the 1990s, even as there is this changing landscape for women. And you know, when I first wrote the book, I was like, the, the CoStar is going to be Women's liberation, Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis and Women's Liberation and how they intersect.
00:06:12 - around pegan a square hole that didn't work together. The media became the CoStar. And I think even with these dramatic changes and social movements and political advances and changes in the culture, the ongoing expectation is that there is this domestic role that women serve. Even, even when right in front of you there is an obvious, a life beyond the domestic, but the, I think that there just is a real difficulty even with all these changes to understand the consequence of those changes and challenges. I really think, you know, people I think are fascinated
00:06:55 - Like when I, when I am out and about, people are like, what a fascinating life she led. Can you imagine being there for the assassination? Do you think she loves John Kennedy? Do you think she like that there is just this interest in her and I, I hope the book communicates like what a multidimensional figure she was in her own right. and I think, you know, there is this propensity to talk about her as an apolitical person, and that is wildly untrue, that she is incredibly savvy and incredibly interested in the world. And I think also the fact that she lives a life and does what she wants and never feels compelled to explain
00:07:42 - I did what I wanted to because I wanted to, and you know, take it or leave it. And just, I think that capacity, I try not to be like a biographer who loves too much, but I'm so impressed with that component of her. I think it is the capacity in which a political spouse or a political first lady can really be an asset to a campaign and to an administration. I think if we're, if I'm going back to the 1960 campaign,

"Jackie Kennedy: The Unforeseen Public Magnet"

00:08:23 - that people were like, God, the public is not gonna like Jackie Kennedy, how maybe we should hide her. And then the public was wild for her. So I think the idea that like pollsters know or like, I don't know, the political leaders are like, we know what the people want. Maybe not that, that it feels, even with the Kennedy's team's attention to media, like the organic attraction to her is really fascinating. And I think there is this capacity in which you never know when the tide is gonna turn and this new and untested image or brand
00:09:02 - who knows what's gonna stick when.

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